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Post by JamesP on Feb 27, 2019 19:23:12 GMT -5
Do you think a good understanding of music theory helps with instrument playing?
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Post by jmuscara on Feb 28, 2019 7:06:21 GMT -5
Maybe. I think it helps to be able to communicate. I've had times with other musicians where they start playing stuff and they couldn't tell me what they did. Once we figured it out, I could join them.
What I don't believe is that it limits you. I think you're only limited when you let something limit you.
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Post by JamesP on Feb 28, 2019 8:32:29 GMT -5
The reason for the post is that I was remembering when my youngest daughter wanted me to teach her guitar. She already had a great knowledge in formal music theory and application, so she immediately wanted to know how triads, diminished, etc. fit and where on the fretboard would she find notes, flats, sharps, keys, on and on. Now I do have a bit of formal music training (going back to my early teens) and can read music, etc. but my daughter really challenged me to explain the Chords and how the notes fit her world.
Joe, you are absolutely right - you only allow something to limit you! Good words.
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Post by jmuscara on Mar 1, 2019 7:14:37 GMT -5
I think there are a lot of ways to come at music and it's all good if you're open-minded.
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Post by jbone on Mar 1, 2019 8:56:19 GMT -5
A few things come to mind. 1) I was imprinted very early by my Gramps who learned to play harmonica I think by ear. He played a lot of different stuff from English folk and ballads to ragtime and blues to marching songs. I doubt he ever read a note.
2) I learned mostly by monkey hear, monkey do, but if you hang around musicians long enough you get some definite ideas about the topic of theory. Theory is to me a different language that makes it easier to communicate concepts.
3) Jolene is self taught. In her tweens she had a chord book for piano and learned some basics there. Then with a Joan Baez songbook she learned some guitar. She didn't take any lessons until her 50's after she hooked up with yours truly, and even then she didn't go learn scales and modes and all, she would ask the teacher specific questions about how to play a certain thing. Usually I'd be there and we'd show the teacher what we were trying to do. So she learned differently than a typical student. That was two of us!
4) Some 8 or 10 years ago two neighbor kids heard me play harp at a local festival, and came knocking on the door asking me to teach them. And I tried. I did not know my own self what all it took to play a harmonica. Every inhale, exhale, what holes I was covering and which leaving open, so many nuances and details I just took for granted, I was trying to show these kids- like age 11 and 7- and I just did not have the language or method. Ultimately they gave up. One of them may still be playing, I lost touch with them a couple of years ago.
The takeaway for me is, if you really want to do something, you can probably succeed if you put in enough hours and enough sweat. Some have a natural affinity, some have to find it inside and develop it with more work and struggle. I am proof as is Jolene. But if you want to communicate the ideas in the music you do, or want to do, you need to get some sort of common language to get the ideas across.
Many times when I've written some lyrics, I sit down with Jo and sing some and play some harp, and give her a root key to start with. She will pick out what works 9 times out of 10. Conversely she comes up with something cool on the guitar and plays it for me and we sometimes write lyrics from that end. So we've worked out how to communicate between us pretty well.
I may have been able to learn in more traditional ways early on but I have reason to believe I have had a learning challenge of some kind for much of my life. Despite that I have managed to make a living and also to succeed in my way with music.
Success can be measured different ways. I would not ever pass a harmonica course if I had to recite pieces the same way they were written. I'd get big grades for improv. Other hand, music helped me many times to pay the bills or get what I needed along the way. Tonight we will earn gas $ for the next move in our journey. The past 5 weeks we have stayed in groceries and gas and paid for a new A/C unit on the trailer here. In part thanks to playing music.
Along the way in this journey I have learned a lot by doing, and by listening to my peers, and hanging around forums. It has also been a very hands on adventure.
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Post by jmuscara on Mar 2, 2019 7:44:39 GMT -5
4) Some 8 or 10 years ago two neighbor kids heard me play harp at a local festival, and came knocking on the door asking me to teach them. And I tried. I did not know my own self what all it took to play a harmonica. Every inhale, exhale, what holes I was covering and which leaving open, so many nuances and details I just took for granted, I was trying to show these kids- like age 11 and 7- and I just did not have the language or method. Ultimately they gave up. One of them may still be playing, I lost touch with them a couple of years ago. A number of years ago I tried to teach my wife how to drive stick. I put her in the driver's seat, and she started asking very specific questions about it. I had to switch with her because I had no idea for some of it. It's become so subconscious that I don't know how I do it a lot of the time. Even though I learned in college, I think I had a feel for how to do it before I really learned. Even though I haven't taught anyone how to play an instrument, I think that, especially for young people, there's a certain amount of confidence that I could instill in them. If they've been listening to music all their lives, they already know how a lot of this works. They've heard it. For some reason, people get all apprehensive about playing music, and some teachers do make it worse. I know a couple that spent a few years in Europe, and their little girl started speaking Dutch (I think it was Dutch) without anyone teaching her. She just heard the other people around them speaking it and she picked up on it. It *should* be the same with playing music. This same girl does a lot of musical theater, so I'm sure she could play an instrument but it seems she's a bit apprehensive about it. I would tell her she already knows how it works. But, like learning a language, I think you do have to be careful how you teach someone the rules. If someone is young enough that they can pick up on music or the language without knowing the rules, let them do it. The rules will be there, waiting to be discovered later. I would never want someone to think they have to know the rules before they can do anything. I would turn it around. "You've heard this? That's called this. Next comes that, let's figure out why that works." Etc. It's a tool. You use the best tool for the job.
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Post by jbone on Mar 4, 2019 17:30:15 GMT -5
My one attempt to do that- with my first wife- was a total disaster. We had a friend of mine teach her after one session with me.
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Post by earleg on Apr 10, 2019 14:31:50 GMT -5
Music Theory helped me a great deal. Just understanding the why and how things work makes it much better especially in playing different styles of music. It can be sort of a guide especially when one knows what is possible (or not) within a song key. It isn't all that important for some music styles but still good to know. I think often folks that have played for a while develop an instinctive or subconscious understanding based on experience even if they never studied theory. Generally everything is based on or evolves from Do Re Mi Fa So La Ti Do and often the circle of 5ths.
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Post by JamesP on Apr 10, 2019 15:57:53 GMT -5
+! George.
Reminds me that I heard Chet Atkins admit to having a very limited knowledge of formal music theory. However, he could write out the score to almost any genre of music.
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